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zelilgirlI1ncenu



Joined: 27 Jun 2007

Posts: 265
Location: Dublin

PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 10:06 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Becky wrote:
But Dani, even though you may be cool with it, those who are involved in having abuse hurled at them may not be!


Is censorship the only way to address the issue? Personally I dont think so. I only saw 1 post by Sebastian, I should have been wise and kept it so that I or Jerry or anyone else could refer back to it. No one can do this now.

And again, it is only my opinion. If Jerry or I find censorship offensive what can be done about it? But I do understand that running a board is not easy, John and Jon discovered this at their expense.
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hrtshpdbox



Joined: 28 Jun 2007

Posts: 228


PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 10:46 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Becky wrote:
You can take it up with him if you have a problem with it.

It's on open forum, I presume Ian reads it (not that he doesn't already know how I feel about this stuff).

zelilgirlI1ncenu wrote:

And again, it is only my opinion. If Jerry or I find censorship offensive what can be done about it? But I do understand that running a board is not easy...

I understand, too, that running a board is hard, and I really don't expect things to be done the way I'd like - like Daniele, I'm just expressing my opinion. There is a conflict to say that only extreme problems will be deleted, only to then delete threads where people are merely being pissy to one another. Then there's the issue of deleting an entire thread, as opposed to the specifically "offensive" posts - I've never understood that, on any board. My two cents.
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alan



Joined: 27 Jun 2007

Posts: 323
Location: London

PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 12:42 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Didn't see what happened yesterday, but there have to be limits. If things get too pissy then I'm all for getting rid of the thread. THis shouldn't be a forum where people have to insult each other, they can go to the Ego board for that if they are that petty and stupid.

Keeping the thead just keeps the bile going and everyone else piles in.

It's been cool till now, lets keep it that way.
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Becky



Joined: 27 Jun 2007

Posts: 155


PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 12:59 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

To me, it's like leaving offensive graffiti on a wall. I don't think you saw it at its worst yesterday, Dani. Jason's feelings need to be taken into consideration.
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hrtshpdbox



Joined: 28 Jun 2007

Posts: 228


PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 2:15 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

alan wrote:

Keeping the thead just keeps the bile going and everyone else piles in.

So how about locking a thread, or deleting the supposedly "extreme" posts?

alan wrote:

It's been cool till now, lets keep it that way.

You say it's cool, I say deleting people's posts is very uncool.

Becky wrote:
I don't think you saw it at its worst yesterday...

One can only imagine what the worst was, though, as Big Brother has wiped the slate clean, wiped out the good along with the bad.

Becky wrote:
Jason's feelings need to be taken into consideration.

Did he tell you that he was feeling very hurt, and really, really wished the meanie words would "poof" go away, or was that decided on his behalf? Is there any consideration at all for the possibility that there's more harm than benefit in censoring speech?

darkandweary wrote:
The same mistakes are just being made again.

Word.
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Chris D.



Joined: 27 Jun 2007

Posts: 176
Location: I need to return some video tapes.

PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 2:22 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Becky wrote:
To me, it's like leaving offensive graffiti on a wall. I don't think you saw it at its worst yesterday, Dani. Jason's feelings need to be taken into consideration.


I don't really agree with censoring, but I actually think you and Ian did the right thing. It would have just descended into more nastiness. And everyone here has seen these discussions before, whether they saw yesterday's or not.
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Susan



Joined: 27 Jun 2007

Posts: 207


PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 2:26 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

I hate butting into a conversation that really doesn't concern me, but i guess this concerns everyone who posts here.

The problems start with people being pissy in the first place. We are sometimes very quick to get on a high horse or a soap box; we can be quick to take offense. On the other hand, when someone comes along and starts slinging F-bombs and negativity, it's hard not to answer back in kind. And then as admin or moderator of the board, you see it [the conversation in particular, and possibly the board in general] taking a direction you don't want. So you have two choices: You can leave the post[s] up or you can take them down. Either way, you are going to be met with disagreement.

If you leave it up you run the risk of continuation and further nastiness, of the whole thing getting worse and worse. If you take it down you stand to be accused of censorship. As admin, you can't win.

I have said it before - i almost always opt to leave the thing up and let the posters' words speak for themselves. People calling each other stupid names, with or without swearing at them, is not generally enough to make me take it down. To make me remind them of my rules, yes - on my board, you have to act like grown-ups and not engage in personal attacks. And on occasion i have had to be rather forceful in my reminders, sometimes going so far as to impose "time out" on posters, which i hate, but....if you are egregious enough in your disregard of my rules on my board, i WILL do it. It is usually best - on my board as in life - to take the high road and be a grown-up; answer any pertinent points calmly and let the other guy look like a jerk. But that's hard to do...believe me, i know!!

When i do opt to remove a post, it is usually because the attack is of a very personal nature - bringing someone else's family into it, mentioning killing in any form, perhaps dragging in a person's personal life, or bringing another unwitting party to the argument. Very rarely will i remove posts just because two posters are being babies and calling each other names.

But i have created a culture on my board, by being consistent in enforcing my rules, where i don't often have to remove posts OR posters. And that's MY way on MY board. The bottom line is that this is IAN'S board, and in an effort to create the sort of culture he wants here, he is free - indeed, obligated - to make his own choices here.

I think part of the problem is that his actions seem inconsistent with his original statement, that posts would be removed only under extreme conditions. Posts have been removed under conditions that most would not have deemed extreme. So i think the outcry is as much about that inconsistency as it is the removal of posts itself.

Okay...that's my 2 cents. Sorry to get preachy; i hate MB drama, especially when it can be avoided. I have grown to really enjoy this community, even tho i don't know most of the music you all talk about...i would hate to see it end in rancor.
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Last edited by Susan on Sun Jul 22, 2007 2:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Susan



Joined: 27 Jun 2007

Posts: 207


PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 2:28 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Chris D. wrote:
...everyone here has seen these discussions before, whether they saw yesterday's or not.


I think THIS is the critical point. People continue to have this kind of nasty, negative conversation.

Why?
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Matinee Idyll (129)



Joined: 27 Jun 2007

Posts: 239
Location: Victoria, Australia

PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 2:29 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

That's my 2 cents - but don't worry, it's not original.
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Chris D.



Joined: 27 Jun 2007

Posts: 176
Location: I need to return some video tapes.

PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 4:57 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Matinee Idyll (129) wrote:
"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

That's my 2 cents - but don't worry, it's not original.


Well, you don't often quote yourself, do you?
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hu1me2belv3dere



Joined: 20 Jul 2007

Posts: 4


PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 7:57 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Jerry, I know deletion pisses you off generally anyway, but you don't need to put yourself out on my behalf.
That's not a poke at you. I like you as far as it's possible to like someone out here, and I appreciate the spirit of fairness in which you started the thread.
But for me, you can let it slide. The thing with Jeff was resolved last night, done with.


Matinee - if you're trying to imply something, don't. Just say it.
I don't believe you have the first clue about what constitutes evil in this world, or what it might look like. But if you think you have identified evil, better not to ask if it would like to go on messenger with you. Satan doesn't do IM last I heard, and neither do I.
Evil - in internet terms, it might be insulting someone's children. It might be telling someone their girlfriend is going to hell because she had an abortion. It might be placing a picture of Sharon Tate's pregnant belly under a Doors lyric about women being killed. Or it might be me calling someone a fucking creep. Take your pick.
If certain people have undergone that great and drastic an overhaul in the way they think and act, in little over a month, I'm glad for them. But don't expect me to have superhuman qualities enough to make the same quantum leap in morality and conduct. Personal change is an evolutionary thing, to me at least, not some revolutionary overnight transformation.




The only other thing is, if your pen-name name is Halleluwah or John Lane or whoever, don't drag my name into matters that don't concern me the second you think my back is turned. Do not say that you know my 'intentions'. Do not assume that because someone is British they must be me. If you're confusing me with the other guy, you're not qualified to make that call in the first place.
The rest is fair game. Random insults aren't something I need to respond to..'cunt' is about as big a compliment as you could pay me.


mathew wrote:
Well people came onto this board who I have no knowledge of me whatsoever, slag me off personally, and slo I'm fucking glad the thread was removed end of.

Person, not people.
Try getting your drink on after you close the browser, matey. That way your post doesn't come out looking like a hot mess.
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AGD



Joined: 27 Jun 2007

Posts: 52


PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 7:59 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

I come here to meet like minded people, engage in a little banter, learn some and maybe butt heads in mild but good-natured disagreement. I come here to enjoy myself.

I don't come here to have some foul-mouthed malcontent with a limited vocabulary spewing his faux-attitude all over the place without a jot of regard for anyone else. Not unlike the drunk on the tube.
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The Grand Fromage



Joined: 27 Jun 2007

Posts: 185


PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 8:02 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

hu1me2belv3dere wrote:
mathew wrote:
Well people came onto this board who I have no knowledge of me whatsoever, slag me off personally, and slo I'm fucking glad the thread was removed end of.

Person, not people.
Try getting your drink on after you close the browser, matey. That way your post doesn't come out looking like a hot mess.


Well, thanks for the sage advice.
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hu1me2belv3dere



Joined: 20 Jul 2007

Posts: 4


PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 8:03 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

AGD wrote:
I don't come here to have some foul-mouthed malcontent with a limited vocabulary spewing his faux-attitude all over the place without a jot of regard for anyone else. Not unlike the drunk on the tube.

But you'll do your utmost to provoke a reaction from him. Like you were doing 12 months ago. And like you're doing now. Right?
I can tell you were just itching for me to post, from the way you waited round the whole time I was logged in, to the way you pounced on my message as soon as I made it.
Why not just admit, you've got a ton of your own issues. You already admitted it to me. If you tell it to the whole board, you might find someone who cares.

Talking about 'drunks', projecting your issues on me. Again, just like 12 months ago.
I've barely drunk since I was 18, Andrew. Never used booze as a crutch. Every so often I'll go and get bladdered with our lass and her friends from the gay bars. Apart from that, not a drinker. Sorry if it doesn't match the image you had in your head. Come chat to me at Festival Hall in a couple of months and see how genuine my attitude is. You've got a first hand opportunity to look me in the eyes and say whatever you like. And don't worry, I don't hit grandads.

Malcontent> go to the mirror.


Last edited by hu1me2belv3dere on Sun Jul 22, 2007 8:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
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hrtshpdbox



Joined: 28 Jun 2007

Posts: 228


PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2007 8:14 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

hu1me2belv3dere wrote:
Jerry, I know deletion pisses you off generally anyway, but you don't need to put yourself out on my behalf.

It's really mostly because deletion pisses me off generally, but your posts are always oxygen-rich breaths of fresh air.
hu1me2belv3dere wrote:
I like you as far as it's possible to like someone out here..

Still, you didn't name-check me in your Faves List the other day, and don't imagine for even a minute that I'm quite over that yet.
hu1me2belv3dere wrote:
Do not assume that because someone is British they must be me.

That has got to be frustrating. Laughing
AGD wrote:
I don't come here to have some foul-mouthed malcontent with a limited vocabulary spewing his faux-attitude all over the place without a jot of regard for anyone else.

I'm sorry, Mr. Doe, but I'm a regular here, and I'm just not going to stop.
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All that is gold does not glitter, not all those who wander are lost. - Tolkien

Censorship reflects society's lack of confidence in itself. It is a hallmark of an authoritarian regime. - Potter Stewart
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