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Chris D.



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PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 1:00 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Excellent. Imagine Garden State on an island. You'll like it.
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IanWagner



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PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 1:12 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

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Imagine Garden State on an island.


Laughing

Me and Zach alone on a beach.

"Zach, select some more indie favourites, and then bring your scrubs back over here".
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alan



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PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 1:22 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

IanWagner wrote:
Chris D. wrote:
It would only be cooler if you joined.

And you guys have great points about the sickness and Jacob being central. Perhaps the sickness is the island's way of rejecting people. I find it odd that Rousseau, the pregnant one, is the only person of her group to survive the sickness. It's also funny that Kelvin helps perpetuate the idea of the sickness, but he knows it isn't real, at least at that point in time.


I'm renting it starting this weekend.


Laughing You'll love it. No shit.
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I LOVE JEFF GOLDBLUM!!!



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PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 1:55 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

You will enjoy it Ian. I would suggest watching them as close to back-to-back as you can. It will aid the little bits and pieces of the story no end.
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Chris D.



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PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 11:03 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Here is a list of rumors for Season 4, from Dark UFO. The Desmond one is interesting. I forget what they're referring to.

Quote:
1) Mobisode stories will revolve around a mystery that will include the "redshirts"

2) The rumor is true about cast member having problems on the show and they want off the show.....and they will NOT be missed by many of the cast members

3) Harold Perrineau is asking for a lot of money and does want to be a regular

4) We will meet Naomi's crew sometime next season, but no one has been cast yet...

5) We will find out what happened to Annie.....it is another chapter of Ben's story that will be seen at some point early in the season...

6) Alan Dale (Widmore) will be seen again...

7) Nick Jameson (Richard Malkin the Psychic) will make another appearance this season...

Cool The season will focus on 2 (two) main story arcs that will occur during the season and will explain many of the things we are all wondering about....

9) Ben and Locke will fight and that will question Locke's loyalty...

10) Desmond's future is told in a Season 2 (TWO) episode and it will be tested during this season..

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alan



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 12:21 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Do we know which cast member is the pariah?

I'm guessing Evangeline Lilly (or maybe Sawyer) but that would make it very awkward.....
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Ebb



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 12:52 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

There are rumors it's Naveen Andrews, who hasn't really had as substantial a role on the show as he's hoped. Sayid's a cool character, but he isn't exactly crucial to the show...

I just started watching this show from the beginning a few weeks ago, and wish I'd waited. February's a long time to wait. Evil or Very Mad
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Eric F.



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 1:57 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Yeah, they've been scaling back Sayid so I guess he won't be so missed, but two things:
1) He remains the only one who consistently has common sense and judges character correctly. I'm kind of curious to watch the whole series again to see how much this is true, but i'm pretty sure that every time he's suspected someone is not who they say they are he's been right, up to and including Naomi, though we still don't know what the deal is with her.

2) In the last episode of season 3 he did that thing where he snapped the tripped the guy and snapped his neck using his legs while he was bound and gagged which was the COOLEST. THING. EVER.
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Chris D.



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 2:38 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Fuck, I hope it's not Naveen. Though the problem with his character is that he is too smart, as you say. If they give him more space on the show, they'd have to reveal too much. I wonder if they got more than they bargained for with writing him. Of course, he's still interesting because he's a total composite of Jack and Locke. He has technical skill like Jack, but he's spiritual like Locke. Unfortunately, Jack and Locke will always take precedent over Naveen, bud I'd like to see him stuck on the island and become a leader of the rest of the people who are stuck in (at least) Jack's absence. I'm not sure about Evangeline. Her boyfriend is off the show now, so maybe.
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Eric F.



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 4:48 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

I mean I would say the Kate character has become so underwritten for a while-- she's so useless now! All she does is let herself get captured. in the first season she was this dangerous criminal-- like, "you don't know what she's capable of." Now she just consistently makes bad judgment calls and, yeah, get herself captured. But there's no way they can write her off-- especially given the last scene of the finale!
(Incidentally, one of the things we've argued about is the degree to which the writers have known what they were doing all along or whether they're making it up as they go along. I think they do know what they're doing now, but the one problem with television is that it is filmed over such a long period that you get the unpredictability of actors' egos and whatnot. They could have to change everything around bc an actor wants out!)
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Chris D.



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PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 3:47 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Some more rumors from DarkUFO:

Quote:
1. The AICN stuff about flash-forwards and flash-backs is true. It will be roughly split in half, the flash-forwards will tell a story culminating with how we saw season 3 end. That doesn't necessarily mean just Jack and Kate get off the island, but whatever flash-forwards we see will culminate with Jack deciding they have to go back and trying to convince Kate.

2. The flash-backs will be mostly from Others: Juliet, Ben, Alpert, although Desmond is definitely slated for at least 1.

3. The temple is important, and will be explored in the last half of the season

4. Rousseau isn't telling the truth about her experience on the island

5. Karl and Alex will have a more central role.

6. Sawyer and Kate will continue to be distant.

7. Locke will not be part of the main group of castaways for the majority of the season, he will be off to the temple with Alpert and then doing his own thing.

8. You won't be able to tell right away that what arrives in the ship is bad news, but it absolutely is

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Nick



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PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:03 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Quote:
"And I was wondering why a swindler like Locke's dad would keep such a high profile. Is this guy in on Dharma?"


Locke's dad [the OG Sawyer] does fit the profile of a Dharma exec, or at the least seems to live in the same high crime circles as Sun's Triad dad and Penelope's dad. If they are Dharma. And if he is Dharma, that raises a troublesome point: if it is so easy for Ben & The Others to simply whisk him to the island and have him executed, why couldn't they do this with any other Dharma or enemy agent? Why not do this to Naomi's crew?

Quote:
"Another recent thought: "The Incident" may be Rousseau's team landing on the island. And Rousseau's team may have been working for whoever sent Naomi. Perhaps they've been trying to send teams to find the place for years, and this is why Rousseau's baby was kidnapped and Rousseau has remained separate from the Others and Hostiles while still vaguely working with them."


If Rousseau's team was working for the same agency that sent Naomi, then Naomi's crew cannot be Dharma. Which is possible but in my mind I am connecting Naomi with Penelope's dad and connecting Penelope's dad with Dharma/Hanso.

The Incident, this is the earthquake featured in Ben's childhood flashback, correct? If so I'm not sure about Rousseau's team being able to cause that much damage--or possibley it was The Incident that drew them to the island, just like Desmond's lateness in pushing the button drew the plane to the island. I do like the thinking in connecting Rousseau's party with everything else going on now. If she's telling any sort of truth. It will be interesting to see just what exactly happened with Rousseau. Her story of an expeditionary team doesn't fit well with the facts we know--we already have a scientific team of sorts in Dharma. Now was her team fighting against Dharma or the Others? Could the Others have sustained fighting on two fronts? Have we seen much of Ben's actual reaction to her--he stole her child for god's sake. And also her story hinges heavily on the Plague/Infection, of which we have seen no evidence and have every right to believe as a hoax of some sort.


Quote:
"Think back though the Incident was obviously Dharma centric and happened BEFORE the Purge. This is an interesting shift because the people in the barracks MUST have known what the Incident involved and didn't seem overly concerned."


People in the barracks=hatches? Or just Dharma workers in general? The Purge--maybe this, not the incident, coincided with Rousseau's team--Dharma loses all contact with the Island and sends them in to investigate.

Was the Swan hatch built before or because of the incident? Or was it modified to contain the incident? The flashback seems to stress the fact that the earthquake was tied in with resistance against the Others not anything else, so unless the incident happened while fighting with the Others they could be two separate things. If the Incident is what I'm thinking of...

Quote:
"I'd put money on Jacob being detained by Ben."


If it was Jacob being detained by Ben that would be very interesting indeed. This would mean that Ben was aware of Jacob before the Purge, maybe even had dealings with him. For some reason I always felt Richard kept Jacob away from Ben--until Ben had passed his 'initiation' and purged all of Dharma.

Quote:
"The incident, I imagine is not connected with the "sickness," although I might be wrong."


It hasn't been explicitly so on the show, but there isn't any hard evidence against that theory either.

I don't know if the sickness is connected with the healing properties of the Island--I always thought it was a mental sickness. And I thought it definitely came from the Hanso/Dharma corp as part of their experiments to get rid of the numbers. They've kind of left that topic hanging, sort of like the 'doomsday' numbers. One difference between the sickness and the numbers though--we've actually seen the damage that the numbers can do (unless one believes that everything that happened to Hurley was pure coincidence) but I don't think we've seen any actual damage from the sickness. We just have Rousseau's, Kelvin's and Ethan's word for it--and Juliet has actually stated that Ethan was full of crap and it was not vaccine but part of her experimental treatments for pregnancies--right? Of course the damn medicine has the damn numbers on it as well and except the fact that Aaron's rash went away after being injected-- it did go away right?
Quote:

"It's also funny that Kelvin helps perpetuate the idea of the sickness, but he knows it isn't real, at least at that point in time.'


Right, it could be injection for something else--or just part of the psychological experiment. Maybe Kelvin thought that the sickness was real but had gotten so far mentally gone that he'd risk exposure just to get off the island. Rousseau's sickness and the vaccine given by Dharma to the young Ben arriving on the Island dates before Juliet's arrival. Kelvin, Desmond & Claire's vaccine comes after but if connected with Juliet's experiments why even bother injecting if you're a male anyway? Could all be a red herring.

Quote:
1) Mobisode stories will revolve around a mystery that will include the "redshirts"


What do they mean by 'redshirts'--oneshot people that died like that dick professor Arnzt or whatever?

Quote:
2) The rumor is true about cast member having problems on the show and they want off the show.....and they will NOT be missed by many of the cast members


the one problem with television is that it is filmed over such a long period that you get the unpredictability of actors' egos and whatnot. They could have to change everything around bc an actor wants out!

I agree totally. That kind of stuff must be nightmares for the writers trying to actually work out something worthwhile. And I hope it's not Naveen either because although Jack has started to actually rate for me (it's the beard really) I was always rooting for Sayid and Sawyer Jr. over Jack and John. The neck-snapping shizznit was most excellent.

Nice to see that Annie will be touched upon. Ben hid her away somewhere during the purge? Jacob's 'time to get alone' shack?


Quote:
1. The AICN stuff about flash-forwards and flash-backs is true. It will be roughly split in half, the flash-forwards will tell a story culminating with how we saw season 3 end. That doesn't necessarily mean just Jack and Kate get off the island, but whatever flash-forwards we see will culminate with Jack deciding they have to go back and trying to convince Kate.


Actually that's not altogether true--who says they have to get back to the island? And does the ending have to be 'happily ever after'? Does the show have to culminate where season 3 ended or can it go further? Unless the writers have stated this--are they only saying that there will be more flash-forwards or are they actually revealing the content of the flash-forwards? Either way I look forward to the storytelling using past present and future fragments--I think that's very cool.

I am salivating over: Sawyer & Kate remaining distant, Alex, Richard flashback, Temple, and the truth about Rousseau. In that order.

Quote:
8. You won't be able to tell right away that what arrives in the ship is bad news, but it absolutely is


Did anyone in their right mind NOT think that Naoimi's crew would be bad news after Charlie talked to Penelope?

Quote:
He will be off to the temple with Alpert and then doing his own thing.


Oh baby, don't even!
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Chris D.



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 1:28 am    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Nick wrote:
Locke's dad [the OG Sawyer] does fit the profile of a Dharma exec, or at the least seems to live in the same high crime circles as Sun's Triad dad and Penelope's dad. If they are Dharma. And if he is Dharma, that raises a troublesome point: if it is so easy for Ben & The Others to simply whisk him to the island and have him executed, why couldn't they do this with any other Dharma or enemy agent? Why not do this to Naomi's crew?


Assuming it was Locke's dad, and he was Dharma, yeah. Keep guessing, keep going around in circles. Of course, it's possible they could have stolen a Dharma person because Locke's dad says he was in a car crash. If Ben ever had a chance, this would be it. They really covered their tracks with that one. I know I'm in the minority, but I'm still not entirely convinced it was Locke's dad, which would give them one out. The other is the car crash. Otherwise, he isn't Dharma. But I do think he is. Perhaps they used him to hire new recruits.

Quote:
If Rousseau's team was working for the same agency that sent Naomi, then Naomi's crew cannot be Dharma. Which is possible but in my mind I am connecting Naomi with Penelope's dad and connecting Penelope's dad with Dharma/Hanso.


Why can't Rousseau be Dharma? Here's a scenario: the "sickness" is part of the island killing people it doesn't want or need. The island infects Rousseau's crew, but she is spared because she's pregnant. She kills them out of mercy. The Hostiles get the baby. Rousseau lives because she's not a threat on her own (a la Naomi). She also cooperates with the Hostiles because she's alone, but her loyalty to Dharma keeps her separate (this is similar to the facade Mikhail presents). Assuming Naomi is Dharma, the Dharma people may come prepared knowing the island would infect them. By murdering all the people on the island, as Ben says, Dharma may put themselves in a good position. They'd up their value with the island by killing people the island had already selected to live. People who were more valuable. Of course, Jack and Kate live, so Ben could have been stretching the truth quite a bit. But it's an idea.

Quote:
The Incident, this is the earthquake featured in Ben's childhood flashback, correct?


I don't think that's been made explicit, but it's certainly one possibility. But do we know that it was just an earthquake? Was this a cover story or assumption?
Quote:
If so I'm not sure about Rousseau's team being able to cause that much damage--or possibley it was The Incident that drew them to the island, just like Desmond's lateness in pushing the button drew the plane to the island.


Could be two unrelated events. Or, as you say, the Incident drew them. I do like that idea. Perhaps it had to do with the EMF.

Quote:
I do like the thinking in connecting Rousseau's party with everything else going on now. If she's telling any sort of truth. It will be interesting to see just what exactly happened with Rousseau. Her story of an expeditionary team doesn't fit well with the facts we know--we already have a scientific team of sorts in Dharma.


Her team must be important somehow, if only for a major revelation about the importance of fertility on the island. It would be easier to say if we know something about the other members.

Quote:
Have we seen much of Ben's actual reaction to her--he stole her child for god's sake.


No, and this is interesting. In fact, we don't know if she ever saw him before she caught him in the net. And it would be funny if they made the metaphor literal just to hint at Ben being Alex's dad.

Quote:
And also her story hinges heavily on the Plague/Infection, of which we have seen no evidence and have every right to believe as a hoax of some sort.


I like how they use really vague, simplistic language for so many things. "Sickness" could be anything - disease or insanity. It's like "Hostiles" or "Others." Doesn't really mean anything.

Quote:
People in the barracks=hatches? Or just Dharma workers in general? The Purge--maybe this, not the incident, coincided with Rousseau's team--Dharma loses all contact with the Island and sends them in to investigate.


The barracks is the neighborhood, not the hatches.

Quote:
Was the Swan hatch built before or because of the incident? Or was it modified to contain the incident? The flashback seems to stress the fact that the earthquake was tied in with resistance against the Others not anything else, so unless the incident happened while fighting with the Others they could be two separate things. If the Incident is what I'm thinking of...


The "earthquake" may have been the monster uprooting things. Also, good idea with the Swan. There's no way of telling now, but I never thought of the Swan being created as a way of controlling the EMF so that people couldn't get in, assuming that the Incident was too many strangers wandering in. Also, in the Swan one of the former inhabitants painted something about "325" being a way out, so Ben's coordinates are most likely correct. Perhaps the way in and out was kept secret from everyone (an underwater station would be good for this), especially the Hostiles.

Quote:
If it was Jacob being detained by Ben that would be very interesting indeed. This would mean that Ben was aware of Jacob before the Purge, maybe even had dealings with him. For some reason I always felt Richard kept Jacob away from Ben--until Ben had passed his 'initiation' and purged all of Dharma.


It will be very interesting when we finally get to see Ben and Jacob meeting. That idea has led me to wondering what the layout will be for the rest of the seasons. I do think the series will end with Jack and Kate getting back to the island. But will next season be about Jacob? They have said that Jacob is a "question for Season 4." We'll see. The first one was about the castaways, the second about the tail section, and the third about the Others. I think Season 4 could be about Jacob and the Hostiles, while the following season will be about Dharma, and the final season may focus more closely on the island itself.

Quote:
I don't know if the sickness is connected with the healing properties of the Island--I always thought it was a mental sickness. And I thought it definitely came from the Hanso/Dharma corp as part of their experiments to get rid of the numbers. They've kind of left that topic hanging, sort of like the 'doomsday' numbers. One difference between the sickness and the numbers though--we've actually seen the damage that the numbers can do (unless one believes that everything that happened to Hurley was pure coincidence) but I don't think we've seen any actual damage from the sickness.


Good stuff. I'm wondering how and when these numbers will really come into play. Will we learn more about them through Dharma or the island? What does Ben know about them? Does he try to use them? We really haven't seen the extent to which Dharma tried to manipulate workers. For example, did they promote breeding?

Quote:
We just have Rousseau's, Kelvin's and Ethan's word for it--and Juliet has actually stated that Ethan was full of crap and it was not vaccine but part of her experimental treatments for pregnancies--right?


I'm not sure, but that could be right. He certainly can't be as important as Juliet because he's dead.

Quote:
Of course the damn medicine has the damn numbers on it as well and except the fact that Aaron's rash went away after being injected-- it did go away right?


True. Do they use the numbers as a way of trying to make medicine work, almost like praying for a cure?

Quote:
Maybe Kelvin thought that the sickness was real but had gotten so far mentally gone that he'd risk exposure just to get off the island.


If that were the case I think he would have taken his suit off once he got to the boat, being too paranoid to risk wandering around the island and exposing himself.

Quote:
Rousseau's sickness and the vaccine given by Dharma to the young Ben arriving on the Island dates before Juliet's arrival. Kelvin, Desmond & Claire's vaccine comes after but if connected with Juliet's experiments why even bother injecting if you're a male anyway? Could all be a red herring.


Superstition, maybe. Being connected to Dharma, the vaccine may have no real use. Dharma is gone, so the vaccine doesn't really have to be important to the story. The island itself is obviously bigger. Or perhaps the vaccine is solely for people new to the island. The Hostiles can't possibly have a use for it, but it's still around for some reason.

Quote:
What do they mean by 'redshirts'--oneshot people that died like that dick professor Arnzt or whatever?


Hahaha, yeah, pretty much. Disposable background characters, like the ensigns on Star Trek (who wore red shirts).

Quote:
Nice to see that Annie will be touched upon. Ben hid her away somewhere during the purge? Jacob's 'time to get alone' shack?


He took her up to The Point for some luv, excused himself to take the vaccine because he was too afraid of catching diseases, but never came back since he couldn't unwrap the condom. She's still waiting and will wander back home in Season 4.

Quote:
Actually that's not altogether true--who says they have to get back to the island?


True. Personally, I think the series will end with them getting back and wanting to be there, because it started with them crashing and not wanting to be there. Perhaps everyone has to be on the same plane for it to crash again.

Quote:
And does the ending have to be 'happily ever after'?


Nope, but I think they will go for sort of a mixed ending. I could see it being a moment of happiness after a huge struggle, or a moment where the character isn't quite sure if they've won, but we're made to feel they have. In spite of all the danger, it's a fairly upbeat show. Remember all those weepy, happy endings in Season 1 with the shitty music while everyone sat on the beach?

Quote:
Does the show have to culminate where season 3 ended or can it go further? Unless the writers have stated this--are they only saying that there will be more flash-forwards or are they actually revealing the content of the flash-forwards? Either way I look forward to the storytelling using past present and future fragments--I think that's very cool.


I think they've said that the flashforwards will flesh out parts of the same series of events. In other words, we'll find out about the rescue through different characters' eyes. But that doesn't mean they couldn't go further than that. Of course, we don't know what further is. The piece we've seen in this series of events may be the middle, so we'll think they're going further when they're really sketching out a part of the end which they always knew about. I think that they're basically introducing the end of the show halfway through, but that's just a hunch. Also, the creators have hinted that the ice station scene was also a flashforward. That would make sense considering Charlie's conversation with Penelope. Of course, you have to wonder how they register the EMF, then.


Quote:
Oh baby, don't even!


Locke will get his own spin-off, Locke and a Hard Place, in which he learns to adjust to his new life on the island just tryin' to impregnate an' goin' for broke.
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Nick



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 6:56 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Quote:
I know I'm in the minority, but I'm still not entirely convinced it was Locke's dad, which would give them one out.


I like this answer better than the 'car crash' and you're not in the minority--my wife and I both question whether or not he was telling the truth to Locke. The main problem with that is the whole kidney donor matchup--unless the old man did an extensive medical record check on Locke and found him a match and an orphan. I'd like to see more of Locke's 'mom' really.

Quote:
Why can't Rousseau be Dharma? Here's a scenario: the "sickness" is part of the island killing people it doesn't want or need. The island infects Rousseau's crew, but she is spared because she's pregnant. She kills them out of mercy. The Hostiles get the baby. Rousseau lives because she's not a threat on her own (a la Naomi). She also cooperates with the Hostiles because she's alone, but her loyalty to Dharma keeps her separate (this is similar to the facade Mikhail presents). Assuming Naomi is Dharma, the Dharma people may come prepared knowing the island would infect them. By murdering all the people on the island, as Ben says, Dharma may put themselves in a good position. They'd up their value with the island by killing people the island had already selected to live. People who were more valuable.


Ah, I don't know why I thought that--Rousseau could definitely be Dharma--sent by them to investigate the lack of contact (the Purge)

I'm totally convinced that Rousseau is lying about her teammates getting infected so I have a hard time with this theory. But if I'm wrong then the reasoning is solid--except why did she not get infected after her pregnancy was over? Is that what you mean by she "lives because she's not a threat on her own"? I agree with her being the same as Mikhail--which by the way, do you thing he really was canned by the grenade? The man can take some serious damage.

If Naomi is Dharma, having her arrive on the island sans biohazard suit would be a blow to the 'sickness' theory as well--unless she was on a suicide mission--or they just didn't tell her. Ahh--everytime I think I gain a solid point by logic, I contradict it immediately!

Quote:
Of course, Jack and Kate live, so Ben could have been stretching the truth quite a bit. But it's an idea.


Or, Jack and Kate took sides with Ben and repelled Dharma/Naomi, allowing them to live and get off of the island, in their unhappy way.

Quote:
I don't think that's been made explicit, but it's certainly one possibility. But do we know that it was just an earthquake? Was this a cover story or assumption?


If not an earthquake, something powerful enough to shake the ground from far away--which makes me think it not a skirmish between Dharma and the Others but something else. I was just calling it an earthquake for reference.

Yeah, betting it could be the Incident or the Purge that drew Rousseau's team to the island.

Quote:
In fact, we don't know if she ever saw him before she caught him in the net. And it would be funny if they made the metaphor literal just to hint at Ben being Alex's dad.


Hell, I forgot about that! Either she knows Ben and is in an extremely odd relationship with him or she didn't know whom she had caught. I'm thinking odd relationship--like you said with Mikhail, she seems to have had uneasy alliances with the Others--so this would have her dealing with Ben, their leader, at some point.

Quote:
I like how they use really vague, simplistic language for so many things. "Sickness" could be anything - disease or insanity. It's like "Hostiles" or "Others." Doesn't really mean anything.


I know, me too. They'e iconic terms, that end up being hollow. Like the black & white backgammon pieces Locke tells Walt about in the very beginning.

Even though I am interested in the history of the Island, Jacob and the Hostiles (terrible name for a band) I am even more interested in the evil doings of Dharma--that's the season/story I want to see.

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We really haven't seen the extent to which Dharma tried to manipulate workers. For example, did they promote breeding?


Yeah, the whole set up is very commune/brainwashing/escaped Nazi scientist working in the jungle creepy. And the numbers, I really want to see those explained--unless the Lost Experience explanation as the answer to their "doomsday equation" is the one. But that wouldn't explain the bad luck association which I love.


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Do they use the numbers as a way of trying to make medicine work, almost like praying for a cure?


Or, just a thought, is the Island projecting these numbers (a background radiation of sorts) into people's minds so that they use it unknowingly? On the hatch, on the labels, into Dharma's equation.

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If that were the case I think he would have taken his suit off once he got to the boat, being too paranoid to risk wandering around the island and exposing himself.


But I thought he did, or at least took off the helmet. When Desmond found him. I'll have to rewatch that.

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Hahaha, yeah, pretty much. Disposable background characters, like the ensigns on Star Trek (who wore red shirts).


This reminds me (besides reminding me of the only redeeming quality Boone had--Trek knowledge) what do you think about J Abrams new movie 1-18-08 or whatever that's coming out before his Trek movie?

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She's [Anne] still waiting and will wander back home in Season 4.


Not until Walt stumbles upon her in the plains and shows her his Black Rock and hits puberty. That stuff coming out of his mouth when he was ghosting Shannon? Not sea water; dew off the lily pads.

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True. Personally, I think the series will end with them getting back and wanting to be there, because it started with them crashing and not wanting to be there. Perhaps everyone has to be on the same plane for it to crash again.


Yeah, I feel you're right as well, but, hmm, I don't know what I would prefer really. I don't think they will try and get everyone on the same plane though, that would be too much.

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Nope, but I think they will go for sort of a mixed ending. I could see it being a moment of happiness after a huge struggle, or a moment where the character isn't quite sure if they've won, but we're made to feel they have. In spite of all the danger, it's a fairly upbeat show. Remember all those weepy, happy endings in Season 1 with the shitty music while everyone sat on the beach?


Those were weird--I wonder why those were shoehorned in there--corporate sponsorship? They didn't bother us so much because usually what happened before was so harrowing we welcomed any respite, but looking back, yes that music sucked. And having our subtitles on made it seem like karaoke. Hopefully if they do a happy ending at least there will be a spoilsport flash at the end--you know, Richard changing John Locke's colostomy bag in Jack's hospital or something.


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I think they've said that the flashforwards will flesh out parts of the same series of events. In other words, we'll find out about the rescue through different characters' eyes. But that doesn't mean they couldn't go further than that. Of course, we don't know what further is. The piece we've seen in this series of events may be the middle, so we'll think they're going further when they're really sketching out a part of the end which they always knew about. I think that they're basically introducing the end of the show halfway through, but that's just a hunch. Also, the creators have hinted that the ice station scene was also a flashforward. That would make sense considering Charlie's conversation with Penelope. Of course, you have to wonder how they register the EMF, then.



I think your hunch is right, and when I think about it I like the idea of flash-forwards working backwards into the story. The icestation a flashforward? That's odd. Unless there's that old time lag thing working and it took some time for the EMF pulse to reach the outside world. Penelope & Charlie's conversation requires re-viewing I think. It's like they stretch the entire episode out until one point where tons of important detail can be crammed in there and it has to be watched over and over again and every word spoken carries much weight.
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Chris D.



Joined: 27 Jun 2007

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Location: I need to return some video tapes.

PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 9:54 pm    Post subject: If a post contains some illegal issues you may abuse on it - just click Abuse and fill the form Reply with quote

Nick wrote:
I like this answer better than the 'car crash' and you're not in the minority--my wife and I both question whether or not he was telling the truth to Locke. The main problem with that is the whole kidney donor matchup--unless the old man did an extensive medical record check on Locke and found him a match and an orphan. I'd like to see more of Locke's 'mom' really.


Actually, I meant that I'm not sure it's Anthony Cooper on the island. But you're right, Cooper could be lying about his relationship with Locke. So how did he find Locke? Will the answer to this lead to greater knowledge about why they all ended up on the island together?

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I'm totally convinced that Rousseau is lying about her teammates getting infected so I have a hard time with this theory. But if I'm wrong then the reasoning is solid--except why did she not get infected after her pregnancy was over? Is that what you mean by she "lives because she's not a threat on her own"? I agree with her being the same as Mikhail--which by the way, do you thing he really was canned by the grenade? The man can take some serious damage.


I meant that the island simply doesn't see her as a threat after getting to know her, and it may have let her live at first due to the pregnancy. Because the other people were researchers, the island may have tried to eliminate them, perceiving them as threats.

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If Naomi is Dharma, having her arrive on the island sans biohazard suit would be a blow to the 'sickness' theory as well--unless she was on a suicide mission--or they just didn't tell her. Ahh--everytime I think I gain a solid point by logic, I contradict it immediately!


Haha, they do cover their tracks. She also could have taken a vaccine before coming on the island. Though, if she arrived in a suit it would probably be easier to convince the castaways to leave, since she could convince them they may be very sick. I'd say that the sickness doesn't exist, or that the term "sickness" is extremely loose. Perhaps the "sickness" was Rousseau's way of describing visions her teammates had.

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Or, Jack and Kate took sides with Ben and repelled Dharma/Naomi, allowing them to live and get off of the island, in their unhappy way.


How would they get off, though? The island...

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If not an earthquake, something powerful enough to shake the ground from far away--which makes me think it not a skirmish between Dharma and the Others but something else. I was just calling it an earthquake for reference.


You could probably do a whole season about Dharma's early relations with the Hostiles, and how much of it they tried keeping secret.

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Hell, I forgot about that! Either she knows Ben and is in an extremely odd relationship with him or she didn't know whom she had caught. I'm thinking odd relationship--like you said with Mikhail, she seems to have had uneasy alliances with the Others--so this would have her dealing with Ben, their leader, at some point.


I agree with the uneasy relationship. In 16 years (if this is true), she'd have to have seen him at some point. If not him, then obviously his partners. I guess it depends on how you interpret her lines about how he will lie. She may be referring to his stealing Alex in that segment.

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Even though I am interested in the history of the Island, Jacob and the Hostiles (terrible name for a band) I am even more interested in the evil doings of Dharma--that's the season/story I want to see.


I want to see that too. I could be wrong, but I have a feeling that the Dharma story will be limited. I get the impression that they'll focus more on the history of the island and Jacob, but you never know. I would like to know why these big corporations are interested in Dharma and the island. I would like to know exactly what Dharma thought they could accomplish. And I really am waiting for that Pilgrim-Indian moment, if we ever get it. Also - how the hell did these people find the island???

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Yeah, the whole set up is very commune/brainwashing/escaped Nazi scientist working in the jungle creepy. And the numbers, I really want to see those explained--unless the Lost Experience explanation as the answer to their "doomsday equation" is the one. But that wouldn't explain the bad luck association which I love.


I did read online that most of this would be cleared up in an episode entitled "Oh Yeah!" Hurley buys a Kool-Aid plant after winning the lottery. Locke's box company makes the boxes that ship the drink, and Kate actually hides in one of the trucks while on the run. After being trained in shooting by Sayid, the truck driver (a Gulf War vet) is shot by Sawyer. Seems the driver was trying to make it as a con man, but crossed Sawyer one night while having strawberry daiquiris. Kate escapes out of the back of the truck, unseen by anyone else. Sawyer flees. The driver is taken to Jack's hospital and miraculously saved. The boxes are recovered by Dharma and shipped to the island, where they are finally dropped ten years later and used by Dharma in a ritual suicide initiated by Naomi. Karl refuses to drink it because he's never heard of Kool-Aid.


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Or, just a thought, is the Island projecting these numbers (a background radiation of sorts) into people's minds so that they use it unknowingly? On the hatch, on the labels, into Dharma's equation.


That could be. The island's relationship to the numbers is really interesting to me.

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But I thought he did, or at least took off the helmet. When Desmond found him. I'll have to rewatch that.


If I remember correctly, Kelvin took the mask off after he left the hatch. Desmond watches him through a little window or peephole, and his surprise at seeing this is what leads him to follow Kelvin.

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This reminds me (besides reminding me of the only redeeming quality Boone had--Trek knowledge) what do you think about J Abrams new movie 1-18-08 or whatever that's coming out before his Trek movie?


I still haven't seen it. I'm more interested in Lindelof and Cuse than Abrams, but I'll check out the trailer. Does it look good?

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Not until Walt stumbles upon her in the plains and shows her his Black Rock and hits puberty. That stuff coming out of his mouth when he was ghosting Shannon? Not sea water; dew off the lily pads.


Prompting Michael to return and bitterly tell Jack that he couldn't imagine what it's like to have the enemy take your son's cherry.

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I don't think they will try and get everyone on the same plane though, that would be too much.


Probably, but I'm wondering what brought them there. Maybe chance, or maybe it will always be a mystery, but I feel like there was some reason. That feeling itself is probably the point they're trying to make, though. You never know in life.

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Those were weird--I wonder why those were shoehorned in there--corporate sponsorship? They didn't bother us so much because usually what happened before was so harrowing we welcomed any respite, but looking back, yes that music sucked. And having our subtitles on made it seem like karaoke. Hopefully if they do a happy ending at least there will be a spoilsport flash at the end--you know, Richard changing John Locke's colostomy bag in Jack's hospital or something.


I've always been amazed with their somewhat poor taste in music. But, I'd rather not have the songs overwhelm the show either. And they have slipped some good songs in here and there. I dig ur ending. I also predict that Emmanuel Lewis is a Hostile. He doesn't age!


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The icestation a flashforward? That's odd. Unless there's that old time lag thing working and it took some time for the EMF pulse to reach the outside world. Penelope & Charlie's conversation requires re-viewing I think. It's like they stretch the entire episode out until one point where tons of important detail can be crammed in there and it has to be watched over and over again and every word spoken carries much weight.


It's one of the "hot" theories, I guess, but yeah - I don't know exactly how it would fit or be true. The writers were purposely cryptic in saying that 60% of what we thought would be true. What exactly did we think? Maybe Penelope isn't trying to come to Desmond, but she was trying to find him to warn about people coming. Though, she'd probably act less surprised about the boat then. I agree about rewatching her conversation with Charlie. I really need to see that episode again.
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